Mom: Son, I need to talk to you.
Son: What about?
Mom: Remember that talk we had a few months ago? When you blew my mind about not being a Roman Catholic anymore? And all the other stuff you told me about the apostles and Jesus and Mary?
Son: How could I forget? You didn’t talk to me for over a month. Then I started to get phone calls from Bill and Aunt Josie telling me I was going to Hell unless I came back to Mother Church and confessed the errors of my ways. I even got calls from family members, who hadn’t been to church in years, wanting to know what happened to me. It was amazing!
Mom: For that you can blame me.
Son: I figured that when it started.
Mom: I just thought maybe someone could talk some sense into you and you would forget all of that stuff you were talking about.
Son: Actually - I have to thank you.
Mom: Thank me? You’re kidding. I heard what some of them said to you. A lot of it wasn’t very nice.
Son: I know. Especially from Bill and Aunt Josie. They got pretty nasty. They said I hated Roman Catholics.
Mom: I heard.
Son: But it was okay.
Mom: I don’t understand. I heard that they did a lot of yelling and threatening to you.
Son: It’s true - they did. But it gave me an opportunity to share things from the Bible that they were unaware of. And to explain to them why I believe what I believe and that it was out of love and concern for them that I was sharing what I was with them. If I didn’t love them - I wouldn’t bother. Who needs the grief?
Mom: Well, I know you blew some of their minds. Like you did me.
Son: My intention isn’t to blow anybody’s mind but just to explain to them why I left the Roman Catholic Church.
Mom: Well - your brother Bill and your Aunt Josie don’t want to ever talk to you again. That’s what they told me.
Son: I’m sorry to hear that. But there’s a reason for that kind of reaction.
Mom: What reason?
Son: They feel threatened! They have believed what they were taught in the Roman Catholic Church all of their lives. To the point to where they dedicated themselves to serving it as a full-time vocation. That’s why Bill became a priest and Aunt Josie a nun. Now I come along and tell them that they have believed a lot of lies and false teachings. So it’s only natural that they would get upset and be mad. I’m shaking their comfort zone and they can’t handle it. So instead of checking out what I’ve got to say - they reject me and what I said out of hand.
Mom: That doesn't seem right.
Son: It isn’t. But what can I do? As a Christian, I am supposed to share the “Good News” of the Lord Jesus Christ with other people (Mt. 28:19-20; Mk. 16:15-16). I especially want to share it with the people I am closest with and who I care the most about. That’s why I had to talk to you. I love you the most of all.
Mom: You’re just trying to butter me up.
Son: No I’m not. I really mean it.
Mom: Well, that’s what I wanted to talk to you about.
Son: About what?
Mom: Well, I finally looked up the Bible passages you gave me, about Mary having other sons and daughters. You know, after she had given birth to Jesus (Mt. 1:24-25; 12:46-47; 13:55-56; Mk. 3:31-32; 6:3; Lk. 8:19-20).
Son: And?
Mom: You were right! It’s seems pretty clear to me and should to anyone reading the Bible, that she did have other kids after the birth of Jesus.
Son: I know.
Mom: So why does the Catholic Church teach that she didn’t?
Son: Maybe it was so they could elevate her to a position of deserving worship.
Mom: What do you mean?
Son: Well, think about it. If she was just an ordinary woman - how could you justify worshiping her? But if you could say of her that she was a virgin all of her life and that she was the mother of God and that she was sinless, then you could make her into a person worthy of worship. Even equal to the Lord Jesus.
Mom: I don’t understand.
Son: Would you be willing to worship someone and pray to that someone and give money in the name of that someone if you did not think of that someone in the same way you do with God?
Mom: No.
Son: So maybe that is your answer. I remember what took place when my buddy Bob married his wife Jan.
Mom: Remember what?
Son: What she did after the priest pronounced them man and wife and before they went down the aisle to leave the church.
Mom: What already?
Son: After the priest was through with his part of the ceremony, Jan walked over to the statue of Mary that was at the front of the church and off to the side and knelt down before it and I guess she prayed to it while she was on her knees before it. I never forgot her doing that. And that happened a long time ago.
Mom: So what!
Son: What do you mean, so what? God made it very clear that we are to have no other gods before Him and that we are not to worship or to bow down to any manmade images. It was the Roman Catholic Church that taught Jan to pray to Mary. But according to what God told Moses it was a definite no - no.
Mom: How do you know that?
Son: You can read it for yourself in the Old Testament book of Exodus 20:3-5. And after you read it, you’ll have to decide whose instructions are you going to believe and follow. The instruc-tions, given by God, as they are recorded in the Bible, or those of the Roman Catholic Church. What is really interesting though, is that the Roman Catholic Church is not the first false religion to come up with a so-called “queen of heaven.”
Mom: What do you mean?
Son: Just what I said. The pagan religions have always had their particular version of a “queen of heaven” going all the way back to Nimrod in the days when the “Tower of Babel” was being built. You can read about it in a book called ‘The Two Babylons’ by Alexander Hislop (Loizeaux Brothers, N.Y.) If you read that book, you would be amazed at the incredible similarities between the religion of Babylon and the Roman Catholic Church.
Mom: I never heard of that book.
Son: I know, most people haven’t. It’s considered a classic literary effort what with the docu-mentation of its historical content and the explanation of the teachings of both religions.
Mom: Really?
Son: Really. But if you don’t want to read that book but do want to read about another “queen of heaven” that the Jewish people gave worship to, all you have to do is turn to the Old Testament and read Jeremiah 7:17-18 and Jeremiah 44:15-30. In those Bible passages you will read about a woman, who the people of Judah worshipped and sacrificed to. A woman they referred to as, "the queen of heaven."
Mom: You’re kidding!
Son: No. I’m not.
Mom: I never heard of that.
Son: Who has? But the point is that God got ticked off at the people of Judah for doing that and He judged them big time. The people of Judah paid a big price for worshiping and sacrificing to that particular “queen of heaven.” And so did the people of Egypt for that matter.
Mom: Really?
Son: Yep. And there is a reason why. God describes Himself in the Old Testament as being a jealous God in a number of passages (Ex. 20:5; Ex. 34:14; Dt. 4:24; 5:9; 6:15; Josh. 24:19). The word “jealous” means that He is unwilling to share His people or the love of His people and their worship with anyone or anything! And that’s a fact.
Mom: I’m glad you’re not preaching to me.
Son: Here we go again. I’m not preaching to you. But I am trying to teach you some of the stuff I have learned.
Mom: You’re sweet.
Son: I don’t know if it’s you who is now doing the buttering up bit or if you’re just trying to aggravate me.
Mom: That’s part of what being a woman is all about.
Son: What?
Mom: To keep men confused.
Son: You really are cute.
Mom: I know. But you’ve really been doing a lot of studying though - haven’t you?
Son: Yes. But only because I want to learn.
Mom: So have you told Bob and Jan that what she did was wrong?
Son: Well, yes. But not so as to offend them. I really don’t want to offend anyone.
Mom: That’s rich. For a guy who doesn't want to offend anyone - you sure do a good job of doing just that.
Son: It’s not so much me as it is the fact that the Bible destroys the teachings of all religions! And people can’t handle that.
Mom: But remember - what you say is based according to your interpretation of the Bible.
Son: That’s the number one cop-out that most people will use. Especially Roman Catholics.
Mom: What is?
Son: The one you just used, that what I am saying is based on “my interpretation of the Bible.” The fact of the matter is that there can only be one correct interpretation for anything you read, if you use the "Literal Method of Interpretation!" In most cases, not all, but in most cases the way you read a newspaper or magazine or book is the way you can read and understand the Bible.
Mom: I don’t know about that.
Son: It’s true! That’s why the brush off phrase of “that’s your interpretation” is a cop-out for the one who says it. They think that by saying that it gets them off the hook. Because they are not interested enough to check the Bible out for themselves to see if it’s true or not.
Mom: I haven’t thought of it quite like that.
Son: That just puts you in with the vast majority of people in the world. That’s all. I’m not putting you down mom, when I say that. It’s just the way most people are. People are just too lazy to check things out for themselves.
Mom: They’re not interested.
Son: You’re exactly right! It’s amazing the stuff that people will memorize. How many guys have memorized the names and battings averages and other statistics for their favorite baseball team? How about the women who have memorized poems and favorite passages from romantic novels. Kids today can tell you the words to songs that are totally unintelligible to adults. Yet, if you asked them something simple about the Bible they don’t have a clue.
Mom: You’re getting on your soap box again!
Son: I know. So sue me! It really bugs me that most people in this country are so biblically illi-terate. There is no excuse for it. Other than the fact that they are just not interested.
Mom: Now don’t get all worked up about it.
Son: It’s just a shame that people don’t see the importance of it all. Life is so short and then it’s over. But what happens then? Most people block that thought out because if they think about it they might get scared.
Mom: That’s true. When I think about it, dying I mean, I sometimes still get scared.
Son: Just know this - that if you trust the Lord Jesus as your Savior - you won’t be afraid of dying. That’s why when the Roman Catholic Church had millions of people killed for trusting the Lord Jesus as their savior, by faith alone, many of them died with a song on their lips as martyrs for their faith in Him.
Mom: When did that happen?
Son: During the time known as the “Inquisition!" You can read about it in various history books. The Roman Catholic Church doesn't want you to know about the “Inquisition" because what was done by their command and authority was truly horrendous. Only God knows how many millions of Jews and Christians were killed by monks and priests and others who worked for the Roman Catholic Church under orders from the Pope. But that is all ancient history and who knows about it today?
Mom: Not me.
Son: Not me either, until I started to search out books that were written about that period of time and what the Roman Catholic Church did to those who would not obey its orders. It was a brutal time that began in 1232 A.D., and it lasted for hundreds of years.
Mom: Really? Hundreds of years?
Son: Yep. You probably think that Don Vito Corleone, of the Godfather movies, was the one who first came up with the idea of making someone an offer they can’t refuse. But he wasn’t. It was the Roman Catholic Church! You only have to go back a few hundred years to confirm this. It was when the Spanish Conquistadors conquered the Indians of South and Central America. There were priests with them who represented the Roman Catholic Church and they made the Indians an offer they couldn’t refuse. Either they believed what the Roman Catholic Church told them to believe or they were killed. Is that a great evangelizing program or what?
Mom: That’s ridiculous!
Son: Not to the Indians who were enslaved and murdered for refusing to bow down to the Roman Catholic Church. This is all part of history, mom. You don’t have to believe me but if you go to a library you can learn for yourself, what a brutal history the Roman Catholic Church has for itself. Look up topics like, "The Spanish Inquisition" or "The Dark Ages" or the influence of the Roman Catholic Church during the Spanish conquest of South and Central America and of California. It’s really quite shocking!
Mom: So how come we don’t know about any of this?
Son: Come on, mom. Let’s be real. Here we have a conglomerate that likes to project itself as loving and caring and benevolent to all human beings throughout the world. Its chief executive officer is held in awe by the stockholders and even by those who are not stockholders because he is the number one representative of God on the planet. His orders and directives are accepted as if God Himself had given them. To disobey or to disagree with this man is equal to doing the same with God. What isn’t known though, to the current majority of stockholders, is the history behind this conglomerate. The fact that it is guilty of all kinds of horrible crimes and atrocities against innocent people who would not believe what they had been told to believe. Now suppose you were the head of this organization or worked in the upper management level of it. Would you want the new and current stockholders to know all of these things?
Mom: Of course not.
Son: That’s right. You would not. And the reason why you would not want your current stock-holders to know the history of this organization is that they would probably sell all of their stock in the company because they wouldn’t want to have anything to do with a company with such little regard for people. On top of that, those people who might have been interested in buying stock in this company would probably not do so because they wouldn’t want to be associated with an organization with such a heinous history. And we know what would then happen to the value of the outstanding shares of this conglomerate. They would drop like a rock in value. Be-cause there would be a flood of sell orders with few buy orders. The result would be a stock market crash for this particular company and the loss of a great amount of money for those who held a large number of shares in it.
Mom: That’s an interesting analogy.
Son: I know. It just came to me while we were talking.
Mom: So how does the Roman Catholic Church respond to the crimes of the past when they are brought up?
Son: Well, the crimes of the past are seldom brought up to start off with. You know that people have very short memories. Politicians depend on that fact. That’s why they will make promises during an election campaign and then do the exact opposite of what they had promised to do when they are in office. They figure that the majority of people will forget about their promises in contrast with their actions by the time the next election is held. And the politicians are right. Most people do forget. So, to answer your question, the Roman Catholic Church has, through the years, tried to cover its history up. They like to pretend that none of these things really took place or happened. Recently Rome has acknowledged that mistakes had been made in the past but it is not a time to look backward but to look forward. The spin from Rome is that because these things happened so long ago, it shouldn’t make a difference to anyone any longer. In other words it isn’t really relevant to us today. Love among the supposed brethren is the anthem of today.
Mom: Okay. I get the point.
Son: I hope so, mom. Because few do.
Mom: I have a question that has really bothered me and maybe you know the answer to it.
Son: What’s the question?
Mom: If God loves us so much why did He create Hell?
Son: Good question and here’s the answer. He didn’t create Hell for human beings but for those angelic beings who rebelled against Him in Heaven under the leadership of Lucifer (Isa. 14:12-14; Mt. 25:41). Afterwards, God changed Lucifer’s name to Satan. Actually, the correct name for that place is “Hades” in Greek and “Sheol” in Hebrew.
Mom: No kidding.
Son: Yep. Hades now is nothing but a holding tank or way station, for all of the people who lived and died without doing the will of God (1 Sam. 15:22-23; Mt. 7:21; 12:50; Lk. 16:19-31; Mk. 3:35; Heb. 10:1-18). After the 1,000 year reign of the Lord Jesus on earth, He is going to judge all of those people in Hades for obeying the will of God and for rejecting Him and then have them cast into the “Lake of Fire” where they will be tormented forever and ever (Mt. 13:42; 25:41, 46; Rev. 14:10-11; 20:10, 15).
Mom: That’s horrible!
Son: I know.
Mom: You mean they can never get out?
Son: Nope.
Mom: Where is the love in that?
Son: God showed His love by sacrificing a special part of Himself, in the person of the Lord Jesus Christ, who died for each of us because of the sins we commit during our lifetime. The only requirement on our part, today, is to simply believe His Word that the sacrifice of the Lord Jesus is enough to save us. The “Historic Christian Doctrine” on the subject known as the “atonement” is this: The atonement through the blood of the Lord Jesus Christ removed forever man’s slavery to both sin and Satan, brought redemption, and reconciled man with God to all who accept it by faith alone (Lev. 17:11; Jn. 1:29; Rom. 3:25; 5:9; 10:9-10; Eph. 1:7; Col. 1:14, 20; Heb. 9:22; 13:20; 1 Pet. 1:19; 2:24; 1 Jn. 1:7; Rev. 5:9; 12:11). In other words, the “atonement” was wholly of God, regardless of any argument to the contrary (2 Cor. 5:21), and completely by grace, not by any works (Eph. 2:5-13).
Mom: That’s what you said before.
Son: I know. I keep saying it over and over again because it is so tough for people to understand. There is no similarity between manmade religions and God ordained salvation! Manmade religion tell you what you have to do for God while God ordained salvation tells you what God has done for you. It’s the difference between Heaven and Hell and it depends on who you choose to believe. So don’t blame God for the people who end up in Hell. The Lord Jesus didn’t come to earth to condemn anyone but to save those who would trust Him (Jn. 3:16-18). Those who refuse to trust Him, as their personal Savior, by faith alone, condemn themselves.
Mom: Maybe so. But it’s still hard to take.
Son: I know. But no matter how much I try not to offend someone, it is just a matter of time before the penalty for rejecting God’s love gift, has to be brought up.
Mom: I don’t like this subject! So lets change it.
Son: Okay. But there will come a time when the subject of eternal punishment will have to be considered and addressed by everyone. Because then they won’t be able to avoid it.
Mom: I guess I have no choice but to ask you to explain why you just said what you did.
Son: The word “death” means “separation” and the word “life” means “connection” in the original languages from which they are translated into English. To die physically is to have one’s immortal spirit separate from the physical body it dwelled in (Lk. 16:19-31). That is referred to as the “first death” in the Bible. When one’s immortal spirit is separated from the presence of God, that is referred to as the “second death” (Rev. 20:11-14). On the other hand, to have eternal life means that one’s immortal spirit will forever be connected to God. In other words where God is, that human being connected to Him, will forever be also (Rev. 21:1-4).
Mom: So all of these words have definite and clear meanings?
Son: That’s exactly right. What most people don’t truly understand is that every human being is an immortal spirit being housed in a temporary physical body. In other words, every human being is going to live forever! Whether they want to or not and whether they like it or not and whether they believe it or not. But most people think that death means the end of everything. In fact, the most common reason why someone will commit suicide is because they want to cease to exist. Living has become that unbearable to them. They don’t understand that they may kill their body, but their spirit will continue to live on. So what they hope to accomplish by killing them-selves is not going to happen. They will continue to exist, consciously, somewhere. Either in conscious, eternal joy with the Lord Jesus or in conscious, eternal torment without Him. That will be the destiny for every human being. There are no other options or choices. God made a decision to love us even though there is nothing about us that would give Him reason to do so. And because of His love for us He wants us to be connected to Him and not separated from Him.
Mom: But I believe that!
Son: I’m glad to hear that. But remember, we are talking about people who don’t.
Mom: I have to admit that was pretty interesting. Now before you go off on another tangent I wanted to ask you about Peter. You said that he was not the first Pope.
Son: That’s right.
Mom: So why should I believe you?
Son: Would you believe the Bible?
Mom: I think so.
Son: Well, if you read the 15th chapter of Acts you would find that there was a major dispute concerning whether it was necessary or not for all men to be circumcised in order to be saved. In reading this account you will notice that Peter isn’t the man in charge of this council attended by believers and the apostles and elders of the church (Acts 15:4). The man in charge of this council is James, who is a half-brother of the Lord Jesus and the son of Mary and Joseph, (Mt. 13:55; Mk. 6:3; Gal. 1:19). This man James became a believer in the Lord Jesus after His resurrection from the dead (Acts 1:14; 1 Cor. 15:7). James became the leader of the Jerusalem church (Acts 12:17; 15:13; 21:18; Gal. 1:19; 2:9, 11-12). Not Peter! And it was this same James who wrote the Letter of James. So the question that needs to be answered is this: If Peter was the first Pope, why wasn’t he in charge of the Jerusalem Council?
Mom: I don’t know.
Son: It’s because he wasn’t the first Pope. He wasn’t a Pope. There wasn’t any such thing as a Pope during the first three hundred years after the resurrection of the Lord Jesus!
Mom: It’s really tough to deal with the thought that I’ve been taught to believe lies by people I have always trusted. You don’t know how bad it was for me, to think about all of the things you told me the first time.
Son: I know, mom. How about this one. You’ve also been told that Peter was never married. Isn’t that right?
Mom: Well, of course. Everybody knows that the Pope, like the priests, are not to marry.
Son: Well, if you read Matthew 8:14-15 and Mark 1:29-31 and Luke 4:38-39 you will learn that Peter was married and that the Lord Jesus even healed Peter’s mother-in-law when she was sick.
Mom: No way!
Son: All you have to do is read it for yourself.
Mom: So what’s to be made out of all of this?
Son: You’ve been lied to and taught a lot of religious junk. It’s that simple.
Mom: You’re doing it to me again. You do know that - don’t you?
Son: What?
Mom: Blowing my mind.
Son: I love when you use those old sayings!
Mom: What do you mean?
Son: When you say things like “blowing my mind” or “get out of town” and “groovy.”
Mom: So what do you want to make out of it?
Son: Nothing. It’s just kind of funny the expressions you use.
Mom: You’re driving me crazy and you think I’m funny.
Son: Don’t get offended. It was just an observation.
Mom: So I use old expressions and I’m funny. Is there anything else?
Son: You’re very combative.
Mom: I didn’t use to be. But with the garbage I had to put up with from your father and his mother, God rest their souls, it was either fight back or become a permanent doormat.
Son: I know. You had to become a tough broad.
Mom: That’s right. And I did.
Son: I know. Remember. I was there to see a lot of it take place. Besides, you’ve told me about it a thousand times.
Mom: You wouldn’t be getting smart with your old mother, would you?
Son: Me? Smart? Never!
Mom: I raised a wise guy.
Son: But you still love me!
Mom: Of course. And I’m very proud of you.
Son: Of me? What for?
Mom: For being willing to put up with all the grief the family has been giving you. Especially Bill and Josie. They say that you’re unloving - judgmental - a bigot - and into Catholic bashing.
Son: I make it a point not to take it personally. They just don’t understand. I keep hoping that one of these days, they will check out some of this stuff and come to understand it. But if they do end up in Hell, and I pray they don’t, they won’t have anyone to blame but themselves. Because they have been told. I hope you can see how serious all of these different things we’ve talked about are.
Mom: Oh, I know how serious they are. That’s why it could drive me crazy. My friend Sue says that we all come back in different lives until we attain perfection.
Son: That’s called “reincarnation.” It’s a teaching from eastern religions and it’s just another Satanic lie to fool people into believing that they will have another chance to get it right after this life.
Mom: Why do you say “another Satanic lie?”
Son: Because the Bible says that, “it is appointed unto men ONCE to die, but after this the judgment” (Heb. 9:27). Do you get it? Once to die - not many times to die.
Mom: I get it. So should I tell Sue?
Son: Of course! Tell Sue to read Hebrews 9:27 and then explain it to her.
Mom: You want me to be like you?
Son: With all of my heart! I want you to go to Heaven with me.
Mom: What makes you think that I won’t?
Son: I’m not supposed to judge whether someone is going to go to Heaven or not. No one is. What I and everyone else am supposed to judge though, are the teachings, of those who profess to know the way to get there (Jn. 5:46-47; Acts 17:10-12). That includes all religions. And the reason why we can do that is because we have the completed Word of God, known as the Holy Bible (2 Tim. 3:16; 2 Pet. 1:21; Jude 1:3; Rev. 22:18-19). We are not to look for the writing of or the giving of any additional Scripture! False Christian religions usually rely on additional writings and revelation, other than the Bible, to support their teachings and beliefs. But anyway, when you can tell me that you are trusting the Lord Jesus as your personal Savior and nothing else. No Roman Catholic Church. No Sacraments. No Mary. No water baptism. No good works. No giving money. No priest. No Mass. No Holy Communion. No nothing but simply trusting in the finished work of the Lord Jesus, alone, for YOUR salvation, then you will know for sure, that you are going to Heaven and you will tell me so. With assurance and confidence (1 Jn. 5:11-14a).
Mom: We’ll see.
Son: It’s what I pray for.
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